Fordnatics List Archive

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: "Fontana Peter" <(email redacted)>

> I have a 67 mustang, lowered front control arms (1 inch, it'll be 2 soon
enough),
I've never heard of -2" . What's the gain?

Does anyone out there want to detail the "correct" procedure for lowering the
upper control arm mount? I've heard that just drilling new holes leaves the
shock tower too weak (makes sense) but what else is needed? Is welding up
the original holes good enough? What did Shelby do on the '65 GT-350's?


> 195/50-15 in front
Yikes - seems too small for the load up there! Do you have tread life
problems yet?

> A) Where can I get a rear sway bar and panhard rod?
Check with Maier Racing in Hayward CA: (510) 581-7600

> How big a tire can I fit in the rear without hitting the wheel wells?
> (I've already bent the lip up as tight as I can). What offset rim do I
> need to get?

> C) How big a tire can I fit on the front?

> I'm considering buying new rims for this project. I dont much care what
> it looks like, as long as it hauls around corners, so I'm thinking of
magnesium rims.

I spoke with the folks at Vintage Wheel Works about their "Vintage 45" - a
loose copy of the Torque Thrust-D in a 16x8 size with a 4.5" backspacing.
They claim to have fit 245/45-16 fronts and 255/50-16 rears under '65-'70
Mustangs with these wheels (they say the 1" control arm drop is "required"
for '65-'66s, and "advised" for '67-'70s). Halibrand now sells them with a
list price near $250 (yes - *each*). I'm very seriously considering this
setup for my next Mustang. Anyway - even if you don't want to dump big $
into rims, you now know how much rubber you can mount on a 16x8 with 4.5"
backspacing.


> Any other handling secrets I can impliment?
First be completely sure your unibody and frame rails are 100% solid. More
rigidity can help a lot - you can look into subframe connectors and inner
rocker bracing. The Shelby export brace and Monte Carlo bar help up front.
Beyond that and what you've already mentioned, you can use some kind of hi-po
bushings (like poly). I've been told by more than one person that you can't
get the most from your Mustang until you get Koni shocks - YMMV. Once that
is done, you put in a roll cage for more stiffness. Losing weight never hurt
handling either.

OK - next time you're following a BMW M3 around a cloverleaf, you can run 'em
right off into the grass!! (Oops - did *I* say that? "Bad, bad Zoot!"

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Eugene Y C Chu <(email redacted)>

About suspension mods to early Mustangs:

>> I have a 67 mustang, lowered front control arms (1 inch, it'll be 2 soon
>enough),
>I've never heard of -2" . What's the gain?
>Does anyone out there want to detail the "correct" procedure for lowering the
>upper control arm mount? I've heard that just drilling new holes leaves the
>shock tower too weak (makes sense) but what else is needed? Is welding up
>the original holes good enough? What did Shelby do on the '65 GT-350's?

If you look at the stock upper/lower arm arrangement of early Mustangs,
when the car is standing still, the upper arm points slightly downward
from the shock tower to the upper ball joint. Usually with stock
springs, the lower arm will be slanted down slightly as well. As the
suspension compresses, such as going around a turn, both arms will swing
up, pushing the steering knuckle (upright) outward. However, because the
upper arm is shorter, it will push out farther than the lower arm for the
same amount of compression. This pushes the top of the upright, and
thus the tire/wheel, outward more than the bottom, generating positive
camber. On the loaded tire (outside of the turn), this causes the tread
to roll under, putting the sidewall against the ground, which probably
track very well. Using a shorter (and stiffer) spring and/or lowering
the mounting point of the upper arm (and properly adjusting the lower
arm) makes it sit more level at normal load. Now when the suspension
compresses, because the upper arm is already at its farthest reach, it
will now start pulling back on the stop of the tire/wheel, generating
negative camber. This helps to keep the tread on the ground when
cornering.

Aside from weakening the shock tower by putting holes into it, there is
one other problem with this approach; the upper ball joint has a limited
swing angle. With the control arm located in the stock position, the
ball joint stud is at mid travel when the suspension is at mid point.
But as you lower the mounting point (or the spring), the stud is forced
closer to one of its limits at rest. When the suspension further
compresses with normal driving, the stud can hit its limits. With the
hard compressions of hard cornering, the studs have been known to break.
The lower ball joint is usually stronger and has greater travel, but it
experiences similar problems.

The obvious solution to the shock tower is to weld plates around the
holes. The problem with the ball joints has been solved a couple of
ways. The cheapest is to make a wedge out of aluminum to mount the
upper ball joint at an angle to put the stud back to its center when the
suspension is at mid point. The costly method is to go see our friend
Doug Nordin at Global West for his Negative Roll kit, which includes new
tubular upper control arms with HEAVY DUTY bearings that mount the ball
joint at the proper angle for a 1 inch drop. The negative roll wedge
kit wasn't available at the time that I was rebuilding the front end of
my 69 Mach I, so guess which set up I got now?

>> A) Where can I get a rear sway bar and panhard rod?
>Check with Maier Racing in Hayward CA: (510) 581-7600

There was a place in LA called Traction Master Corp. that used to supply
most of the suspension components to Caroll Shelby for his cars. They
still had all sorts of stuff for early Mustangs, but I haven't talked to
them for a long time. They are also located in one of the most heavily
hit areas during the 92 LA riot, and the place was run by a Korean, so I
don't know it they even exist any more. Check in the Mustang rags for
their address and numbers.

Something else you want to look at is to tighten up the rear suspension.
At the least, replace all the rubber bushings in the leaf springs with
polyurathane. A good set of leaf springs and stiff bushings could
eliminate the need for a panhard bar. My setup is the GW springs with
the Del-Alum bushings...no sideways wobble at all. The only other
relatively simple addition I can think of for my car is the Shelby
designed over-the-axle traction bars, but those have to intrude into the
rear seating area, requiring cutting the floor pan. My real desire
would be an IRS and coil over shocks setup like one of Shelby's
unpursued experiments, but then it wouldn't be a Mustang anymore.

If anyone else can offer anymore info on early Mustang handling, I'd
love to hear it.

eyc