Classic Mustangs List Archive

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Mail From: Jason P. Ellis (email redacted)

If I am not mistaken you really don't have to change your oil but every
6000 miles anyway. I have read this in new car manuals, and in older cars
like my Mustang. I have heard that that the 3000 miles thing is just to
buy more oil. Profit profit profit.

Also, synthetic sometimes contains bits of teflon which is not good for an
engine. Has anyone ever seen the disclaimed that DuPont put out telling
people not to use teflon in engines?



I do not know any of this as fact. Don't hold me to it.
************************************************************
Jason Ellis
1966 Mustang Coupe
Maritime Systems Engineering
Texas A&M University at Galveston


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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: John M. Dettori (email redacted)

On Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:00, "Jason P. Ellis" <(email redacted)> wrote:
>
> If I am not mistaken you really don't have to change your oil but every
> 6000 miles anyway. I have read this in new car manuals, and in older cars
> like my Mustang. I have heard that that the 3000 miles thing is just to
> buy more oil. Profit profit profit.

Oil lubricates moving parts in an engine, and is also a signifigant cooling
factor. Whenever metal touches metal, minute particles will break off, and
float in a mixture with the oil. Those particles act as an abrasive, scor-
ing the engine internals as they circulate thru the motor. Yes, some are
caught by the filter, but many remain. Changing your oil often is the best
and only protection you have against wear. Oils breakdown through use and
usually contain acids and varnish by the time they are changed. Fresh oil
lubricates and flushes out impurities. I'm a 2,500 mile oil change man my-
self, simply because I think it's easier to remember. I make sure I change
the oil at least quarterly, or every 2,500 miles. An article I read in Car
& Driver in August 1983 entitled "How to Make Your Car Last 100,000 Miles"
suggested this and I've stuck with it ever since. They said "Look at oil
like a very cheap part that needs replacement often."

The owners manuals do recommend oil changes every 6,000 to 7,500 miles. But
those same manuals also say "EXCEPT when towing, making short trips, dusty
conditions, humid conditions, high elevations, warm weather, or extremely
cold weather", when they recommend changing the oil at 3,000 mile intervals.
Which means, unless you drive non-stop coast to cost, you need to change
your oil often. With $10 - $20 oil change places everywhere, how could
you afford not to?

I also drain and refill the tranny and rear axle fluid once a year, or every
10,000 miles. And it gets checked once a month, & when the oil gets changed.
If you ever burned-up a T-5 or saw the ring gears after 50,000 miles of use,
you'd do the same. Very cheap insurance.

Don't know much about synthetic oils, except most of them are parafin based.
I hear alot of good things about "Red Line", "Amsoil", and "Mobile 1". If a car
came with a synthetic oil from the factory, I'd use it. My engine builder is
not in favor of them. When I spend $2,500 with a builder, I listen to his
recommendations.

As for additives, I like DuraLube. The commercial made a believer out of me,
and my SVO seems to like it (gas mileage improved). I bought the kit that
contains the engine treatment, trans treatment, and WD40-like lube. Can't say
enough good about it.

---------------------------------------------------------------
John M. Dettori 86 SVO (2.3l IT)
Divisional VP, Program Trading 70 Mach I (351C-4V)
Paine Webber, Inc. 67 GT conv (289-4V)
New York, NY <reserved 4 67 GT500>
212 713 4683
(email redacted)
---------------------------------------------------------------


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Mail From: Watkins, Paul (email redacted)

Unless you're using some rogue brand of snake oil, mainstream
synthetic's do not have Teflon. You are correct that Dupont did issue a
statement against Teflon additives as a lubricant enhancer.

I do not use "Slick-50'ish" additives but I do use synthetic. Teflon
particles are large enough to be captured by some oil filters, which is
why it can be harmful to an engine. I'm not sure what Fram puts in
their "Pre-Lube" Teflon filters but you could just as easily put a
little oil in that dry filter before you spin it on and it would be
better.

I'm not sure why John's engine builder doesn't recommend synthetic - I'd
be interested in why? I've heard arguments from other builders that
synthetic will not allow an engine to "break-in" properly (they say it's
too good at lubricating) but there is documentation to refute these
claims.

Some other people have stated that synthetic's cause oil leaks or eat
gaskets. There's actually some history to this; when Mobile 1 first
came out the formula was not compatible with all gasket types but that
has long been remedied.

Paul

> ----------
> From: Jason P. Ellis[SMTPemail redacted)]
> Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 1:00 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: [CM:9522] oils---
>
> If I am not mistaken you really don't have to change your oil but
> every
> 6000 miles anyway. I have read this in new car manuals, and in older
> cars
> like my Mustang. I have heard that that the 3000 miles thing is just
> to
> buy more oil. Profit profit profit.
>
> Also, synthetic sometimes contains bits of teflon which is not good
> for an
> engine. Has anyone ever seen the disclaimed that DuPont put out
> telling
> people not to use teflon in engines?
>
>
>
> I do not know any of this as fact. Don't hold me to it.
> ************************************************************
> Jason Ellis
> 1966 Mustang Coupe
> Maritime Systems Engineering
> Texas A&M University at Galveston
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> For information on Subscribing and Unsubscribing as well as a list
> archive please visit:
>
> antler.webworks.ca/cm
>

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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Myjak (email redacted)

> Unless you're using some rogue brand of snake oil, mainstream
> synthetic's do not have Teflon. You are correct that Dupont did
> issue a statement against Teflon additives as a lubricant enhancer.

Dupont has since recended that statement. THey now sell their own
brand of "snake oil" claiming 50% more Dupont Teflon than Slick 50.

There is good evidence that a good percentage of the teflon is picked
up by the oil filter... but there is also evidence that some of the
stuff actually sticks to the internal parts. I can say that of the
engines that I've torn apart, those that used the stuff were on the
whole, cleaner and showed less signs of (oil related) wear and tear.

Just some more of my thots...
-Michael
68 Mustang conv't
'92 T'bird SC


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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Watkins, Paul (email redacted)

I don't doubt your claims but there's not empirical evidence to support
either Slick 50's or, even as you say, Dupont's new position on the
matter. I might suggest that the condition of these engine's is merely
circumstantial. An engine's condition is more a result of an owner's
attempt to follow a routine maintenance schedule. It's safe to say that
the profile of a Slick 50 purchaser is one who takes extra measures to
maintain their vehicle - hence my circumstantial theory.

Regardless, the context of my initial comments was whither or not
synthetic oils included Teflon as a lubricating supplement, which they
don't. In fact, this whole issue of using Teflon as a lubricant is
contrary to the fundamentals of fluid dynamics and thus the whole
lubrication system. Aside from other purposes for oil (cooling,
cleaning, etc...) it's primary purpose is to create a film barrier
between two metal surfaces. Now if you interject Teflon into the whole
equation, you have particulates going between these two surfaces which
most certainly would accelerate wear (much like the extrude-honing
process, just not as dramatic).

Maybe I'm just off base or not as technically savvy but I for one will
stick to the basics. Frequent oil changes with a dash of synthetic and
call me in the morning!

> ----------
> From: Myjak[SMTPemail redacted)]
> Sent: Friday, February 27, 1998 8:50 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: [CM:9645] RE: 9522] oils---
>
> > Unless you're using some rogue brand of snake oil, mainstream
> > synthetic's do not have Teflon. You are correct that Dupont did
> > issue a statement against Teflon additives as a lubricant enhancer.
>
> Dupont has since recended that statement. THey now sell their own
> brand of "snake oil" claiming 50% more Dupont Teflon than Slick 50.
>
> There is good evidence that a good percentage of the teflon is picked
> up by the oil filter... but there is also evidence that some of the
> stuff actually sticks to the internal parts. I can say that of the
> engines that I've torn apart, those that used the stuff were on the
> whole, cleaner and showed less signs of (oil related) wear and tear.
>
> Just some more of my thots...
> -Michael
> 68 Mustang conv't
> '92 T'bird SC
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> For information on Subscribing and Unsubscribing as well as a list
> archive please visit:
>
> antler.webworks.ca/cm
>

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