Classic Mustangs List Archive

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Ron Cordes)

If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with the
jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes but
some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.

Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which reminds
me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock rockers,
Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600 CFM
carb, Model number 1-80145.

If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just getting
all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on the
carb from 2 to 1.

Ron

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Tom Crocker)



----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Cordes" <(email redacted)>
To: "Fordnatics" <(email redacted)>; "Classic Mustangs"
<(email redacted)>
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 3:02 PM
Subject: [Fordnatics] Is my carb to big?


> If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
> ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
> like maybe toll plazas and the such,

Check the basics first.

Vacuum leaks?

Float height correct?

Accell pump correctly adjusted?

Then, start looking at mixture and enrichment. Try a 9.5 power valve.


>I don't want to start fooling with the
> jets or the squirters yet

Too bad! :-)

>I want to ask is my carb to big?

HELL NO! The 1850 on a 302 is one of the most common perfomance mods ever.
Reemember, when you are pulling away from a curb, or cruising, are you using
600 CFM of carburation? Of course not. At WOT, is 600 CFM too much? Maybe
if you ue a formula, but not on the dyno and not on the track. Look, the
Shelby GT350s used a 715 CFM carb on a 289 with a cam not that much bigger.
It ran OK, right? The 600 Holley is just fine.

>.....well here we are.

Time to tune. I see that your carb has #68 primary jets and #70 rears. A
.031 shooter and a 6.5 power valve. I would still change that power valve.
I would not worry about the secondary spring just yet, I think this is
primary related. Also, see what your advance is doing. Make sure the
advance plate is not loose. Might want to not use vacuum advance for now,
if you are.



Tom
TS3
home.earthlink.net/~tcrocker/


>
> Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which
reminds
> me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock
rockers,
> Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
> headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
> stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
> (soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
> 9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600
CFM
> carb, Model number 1-80145.
>
> If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just
getting
> all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
> jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on
the
> carb from 2 to 1.
>
> Ron
>
> | Another Fordnatics post - Author retains copyright - ask before
forwarding |
> | Posts: (email redacted)
|
> | Requests: (email redacted)
|
> | Human in charge: Chris Ferino, (email redacted)
|
> | Please visit our hosts at <mustangworks.com/> !
|
>

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Gordon Couch)

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Ron,

I had a similar problem with my 65 289 after installing the Performer
package, intake, cam and 600CFM 4V. I fiddled with the jets and rods,
bigger, smaller mix and match. Nothing seemed to help. Then I worked on the
timing, following a Mustang Monthly article. That did the trick! What it
amounted to was the timing was too retarded.

Method:

Equipment: Tach and vacuum gauge

1.. Warm motor to normal op temp.
2.. Attach tach per instruction and set idle. (Approx. 650 rpm)
3.. Loosen distributor hold down.
4.. Attach vacuum gauge to vacuum port on carb (driver side for the
Edelbrock 4V)
5.. Advance timing until 100 rpm increase on tach.
6.. Re-adjust idle speed to normal hot idle.
7.. Continue steps 5 and 6 until the motor runs rough.
8.. Retard timing slightly, about 1/4 inch.
9.. Retighten the hold down and disconnect the tach and vacuum gauge.
10.. Drive around the block. Take a 1/2 wrench with, you may have to
retard the timing a little more if there is pinging on acceleration.
Worked for me. Good luck.

Gordon Couch
(865) 694-0605
Knoxville, TN


----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Cordes
To: Fordnatics ; Classic Mustangs
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:02 PM
Subject: [CM] Is my carb to big?


If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with
the
jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes
but
some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.

Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which
reminds
me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock
rockers,
Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600
CFM
carb, Model number 1-80145.

If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just
getting
all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on
the
carb from 2 to 1.

Ron

_______________________________________________
Classic-mustangs mailing list
(email redacted)
mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs

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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2712.300" name=GENERATOR>
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</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Ron,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>I had a similar problem with my 65 289 after
installing the Performer package, intake, cam and 600CFM 4V.&nbsp;I fiddled with
the jets and rods, bigger, smaller mix and match. Nothing seemed to help. Then I
worked on the timing, following a Mustang Monthly article. That did the trick!
What it amounted to was the timing was too retarded. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Method:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Equipment: Tach and vacuum
gauge</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<OL>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Warm motor to normal op temp.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Attach tach per instruction and set idle.
(Approx. 650 rpm)</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Loosen distributor hold down.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Attach vacuum gauge to vacuum port on carb
(driver side for the Edelbrock 4V)</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Advance timing until 100 rpm increase on
tach.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Re-adjust idle speed to normal hot
idle.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Continue steps 5 and 6 until the motor runs
rough.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Retard timing slightly, about 1/4
inch.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Retighten the hold down and disconnect the
tach and vacuum gauge.</FONT></LI>
<LI><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Drive around the block. Take a 1/2 wrench
with, you may have to retard the timing a little more if there is pinging on
acceleration.</FONT></LI></OL>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Worked for me. Good luck.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>Gordon Couch<BR>(865) 694-0605<BR>Knoxville,
TN</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=(email redacted) href="mailtoemail redacted)">Ron
Cordes</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=(email redacted)
href="mailtoemail redacted)">Fordnatics</A> ; <A
title=(email redacted)
href="mailtoemail redacted)">Classic Mustangs</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:02
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [CM] Is my carb to big?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a
thousand miles<BR>ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling
acceleration,<BR>like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start
fooling with the<BR>jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big?
Some say yes but<BR>some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well
here we are.<BR><BR>Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302
heads(which reminds<BR>me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those
heads?), stock rockers,<BR>Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer
RPM intake, Hooker<BR>headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters,
H-Pipe, 500 over<BR>stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny,
2.73 rear 8"<BR>(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil,
BIG cap, JBA<BR>9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum
sec. 600 CFM<BR>carb, Model number 1-80145.<BR><BR>If there is any where I can
be steered please let me know, I am just getting<BR>all the questions out of
the way first by the way I have not changed any<BR>jetting, springs, or
accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on the<BR>carb from 2 to
1.<BR><BR>Ron<BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Classic-mustangs
mailing list<BR><A
href="mailtoemail redacted)">(email redacted)</A><BR><A
href="mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs">mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Mail From: (email redacted) ((email redacted))

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In a message dated 4/23/2002 3:04:37 PM Pacific Standard Time,
(email redacted) writes:


> If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
> ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
> like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with the
> jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes but
> some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.
>
>

Jet extensions? Maybe the jets are uncovering on accel. No way is it too big.
Fuel delivery OK?

Ron

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 4/23/2002 3:04:37 PM Pacific Standard Time, (email redacted) writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
<BR>ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
<BR>like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with the
<BR>jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes but
<BR>some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Jet extensions? Maybe the jets are uncovering on accel. No way is it too big. Fuel delivery OK?
<BR>
<BR>Ron</FONT></HTML>

--part1_59.1a9fe0f8.29f77e2f_boundary--

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Stephen Girouard)

Something seems to be missing ... what reading are you looking for on the
vacuum gauge?

Stephen
1967 Mustang Coupe

----- Original Message -----
From: Gordon Couch
To: (email redacted)
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:17 PM
Subject: Re: [CM] Is my carb to big?


Ron,

I had a similar problem with my 65 289 after installing the Performer
package, intake, cam and 600CFM 4V. I fiddled with the jets and rods,
bigger, smaller mix and match. Nothing seemed to help. Then I worked on the
timing, following a Mustang Monthly article. That did the trick! What it
amounted to was the timing was too retarded.

Method:

Equipment: Tach and vacuum gauge

1. Warm motor to normal op temp.
2. Attach tach per instruction and set idle. (Approx. 650 rpm)
3. Loosen distributor hold down.
4. Attach vacuum gauge to vacuum port on carb (driver side for the Edelbrock
4V)
5. Advance timing until 100 rpm increase on tach.
6. Re-adjust idle speed to normal hot idle.
7. Continue steps 5 and 6 until the motor runs rough.
8. Retard timing slightly, about 1/4 inch.
9. Retighten the hold down and disconnect the tach and vacuum gauge.
10. Drive around the block. Take a 1/2 wrench with, you may have to retard
the timing a little more if there is pinging on acceleration.

Worked for me. Good luck.

Gordon Couch
(865) 694-0605
Knoxville, TN


----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Cordes
To: Fordnatics ; Classic Mustangs
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:02 PM
Subject: [CM] Is my carb to big?


If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with the
jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes but
some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.

Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which reminds
me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock rockers,
Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600 CFM
carb, Model number 1-80145.

If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just getting
all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on the
carb from 2 to 1.

Ron

_______________________________________________
Classic-mustangs mailing list
(email redacted)
mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Eric Atoian)

Why wouldn't he not want to use the vacuum advance? On a stock
distributor can disable this and yet still have it mechanically advance?

-Eric


>I would not worry about the secondary spring just yet, I think this is
>primary related. Also, see what your advance is doing. Make sure the
>advance plate is not loose. Might want to not use vacuum advance for now,
>if you are.




_________________________________________________________________
Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Ron Cordes)

STEPHEN Said:

Something seems to be missing ... what reading are you looking for on the
vacuum gauge?

I have 17inches at idle.

Ron

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (S Best)

Ron, your carb is definately not too big, it just needs tuning. More
compression to work with the cam would be nice. Stock for 86 was around
8.5:1 and the 86 "turbo swirl" head was not the best. Get those 3.25 or
even better 3.50 gears in. The 8" rear will stand up to what you have here
and weighs less.

I didn't follow some of the earlier posts, but have you checked to make
sure the accellerator pump is moving from the first movement of the
throttle? There is an adjustment screw I believe, at least there is on the
double pumper Holley. There should be some preload on the pump.

Steve Best


At 06:02 PM 4/23/02 -0400, Ron Cordes wrote:
>If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
>ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
>like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with the
>jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes but
>some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.
>
>Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which reminds
>me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock rockers,
>Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
>headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
>stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
>(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
>9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600 CFM
>carb, Model number 1-80145.
>
>If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just getting
>all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
>jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on the
>carb from 2 to 1.
>
>Ron
>
>| Another Fordnatics post - Author retains copyright - ask before
forwarding |
>| Posts: (email redacted)
|
>| Requests: (email redacted)
|
>| Human in charge: Chris Ferino, (email redacted)
|
>| Please visit our hosts at <mustangworks.com/> !
|
>
>

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Puter ami)

>From: S Best <(email redacted)>

> Ron, your carb is definately not too big, it just needs tuning. I
>didn't follow some of the earlier posts, but have you checked to make
>sure the accellerator pump is moving from the first movement of the
>throttle? There is an adjustment screw I believe, at least there is on the
>double pumper Holley. There should be some preload on the pump.

I have to agree with Mr. Best here. Mr. Crocker makes the excellent point of
checking all of the basics first. Too many times I have had people bring me
their carb problems and I end up fixing a vacuum leak.

I would not be looking at a Power Valve or secondary springs when the
problem is described as "I am still having the hesitation mostly from a
rolling acceleration, like maybe toll plazas and the such..." This is more
prevalent of the squirter and its related parts, including the adjustment
arm. Please note #4 on the second webpage that I have listed below.

Here's a couple of websites that have been passed around that have good
information.

bob2000.com/carb.htm
jason.fletcher.net/tech/carbtuning/carbtuning.htm

Ralph Bischof
84 GT (turned 200K!)
88 LX


_________________________________________________________________
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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (mrussell4)

I would agree with all thats been said, with a little bit to add.

I have a 80145 on a plain old worn out 289 (long story as to why) with 2.80s
in the rear, and it does not hesitate. Stock 3 speed also, btw, but I don't
have to slip clutch to avoid hesitation.

I think the 80145 is probably a little bit big in my case, maybe not in
yours since you've tweaked efficiency and rpm capability, 2 of the variables
in the CFM equation. But in any case, I would think that if mine doesn't
hesitate / stumble, yours probably shouldn't. I would not think you would
want to go any bigger though.

My top suspect would be timing.

Also, to the list someone provided, I'd add vacuum leak as a possibility.
Those evil, hard to find, vacuum leaks.

Also, consider as best you can all the components as a system:

- RPM intake will probably want a slightly richer mixture at low rpm,
- more open exhaust will probably want a slightly richer mixture at low
rpms,
- 86 heads, as I think someone else mentioned, I think are not the best
in terms of ports and may not be working well with the other pieces (wide
open intake ports choked down at head port to small volume, poor shape could
cause bad turbulence)

I think the tune of the 80145 is on the rich side, as it is intended for the
setup you have, except for the heads, if I have the correct year for the
poor ports. It may be 85, and I hope someone will correct me if I am wrong.

Mark


> Message: 1
> From: "Ron Cordes" <(email redacted)>
> To: "Fordnatics" <(email redacted)>,
> "Classic Mustangs" <(email redacted)>
> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 18:02:15 -0400
> Subject: [CM] Is my carb to big?
> Reply-To: (email redacted)
>
> If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
> ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
> like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with
the
> jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes
but
> some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.
>
> Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which
reminds
> me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock
rockers,
> Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
> headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
> stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
> (soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
> 9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600
CFM
> carb, Model number 1-80145.
>
> If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just
getting
> all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
> jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on
the
> carb from 2 to 1.
>
> Ron

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Gordon Couch)

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I was getting about 15 - 17 inches max. Advance to 100 - 200 rpm increase or
max vacuum, then adjust the idle and do it again.

Gordon Couch
(865) 694-0605
Knoxville, TN


----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen Girouard
To: (email redacted)
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: [CM] Is my carb to big?


Something seems to be missing ... what reading are you looking for on the
vacuum gauge?

Stephen
1967 Mustang Coupe

----- Original Message -----
From: Gordon Couch
To: (email redacted)
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:17 PM
Subject: Re: [CM] Is my carb to big?


Ron,

I had a similar problem with my 65 289 after installing the Performer
package, intake, cam and 600CFM 4V. I fiddled with the jets and rods,
bigger, smaller mix and match. Nothing seemed to help. Then I worked on
the
timing, following a Mustang Monthly article. That did the trick! What it
amounted to was the timing was too retarded.

Method:

Equipment: Tach and vacuum gauge

1. Warm motor to normal op temp.
2. Attach tach per instruction and set idle. (Approx. 650 rpm)
3. Loosen distributor hold down.
4. Attach vacuum gauge to vacuum port on carb (driver side for the
Edelbrock
4V)
5. Advance timing until 100 rpm increase on tach.
6. Re-adjust idle speed to normal hot idle.
7. Continue steps 5 and 6 until the motor runs rough.
8. Retard timing slightly, about 1/4 inch.
9. Retighten the hold down and disconnect the tach and vacuum gauge.
10. Drive around the block. Take a 1/2 wrench with, you may have to retard
the timing a little more if there is pinging on acceleration.

Worked for me. Good luck.

Gordon Couch
(865) 694-0605
Knoxville, TN


----- Original Message -----
From: Ron Cordes
To: Fordnatics ; Classic Mustangs
Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:02 PM
Subject: [CM] Is my carb to big?


If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a thousand miles
ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling acceleration,
like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start fooling with
the
jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big? Some say yes
but
some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well here we are.

Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302 heads(which
reminds
me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those heads?), stock
rockers,
Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer RPM intake, Hooker
headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters, H-Pipe, 500 over
stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny, 2.73 rear 8"
(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil, BIG cap, JBA
9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum sec. 600
CFM
carb, Model number 1-80145.

If there is any where I can be steered please let me know, I am just
getting
all the questions out of the way first by the way I have not changed any
jetting, springs, or accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on
the
carb from 2 to 1.

Ron

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff>I was getting about 15 - 17 inches max.
Advance to 100 - 200 rpm increase or max vacuum, then adjust the idle and do it
again.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Gordon Couch<BR>(865) 694-0605<BR>Knoxville, TN</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=(email redacted)
href="mailtoemail redacted)">Stephen Girouard</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A
title=(email redacted)
href="mailtoemail redacted)">(email redacted)</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, April 24, 2002 12:13
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [CM] Is my carb to
big?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Something seems to be missing ... what reading are you looking
for on the<BR>vacuum gauge?<BR><BR>Stephen<BR>1967 Mustang Coupe<BR><BR>-----
Original Message -----<BR>From: Gordon Couch<BR>To: <A
href="mailtoemail redacted)">(email redacted)</A><BR>Sent:
Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:17 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [CM] Is my carb to
big?<BR><BR><BR>Ron,<BR><BR>I had a similar problem with my 65 289 after
installing the Performer<BR>package, intake, cam and 600CFM 4V. I fiddled with
the jets and rods,<BR>bigger, smaller mix and match. Nothing seemed to help.
Then I worked on the<BR>timing, following a Mustang Monthly article. That did
the trick! What it<BR>amounted to was the timing was too
retarded.<BR><BR>Method:<BR><BR>Equipment: Tach and vacuum gauge<BR><BR>1.
Warm motor to normal op temp.<BR>2. Attach tach per instruction and set idle.
(Approx. 650 rpm)<BR>3. Loosen distributor hold down.<BR>4. Attach vacuum
gauge to vacuum port on carb (driver side for the Edelbrock<BR>4V)<BR>5.
Advance timing until 100 rpm increase on tach.<BR>6. Re-adjust idle speed to
normal hot idle.<BR>7. Continue steps 5 and 6 until the motor runs
rough.<BR>8. Retard timing slightly, about 1/4 inch.<BR>9. Retighten the hold
down and disconnect the tach and vacuum gauge.<BR>10. Drive around the block.
Take a 1/2 wrench with, you may have to retard<BR>the timing a little more if
there is pinging on acceleration.<BR><BR>Worked for me. Good
luck.<BR><BR>Gordon Couch<BR>(865) 694-0605<BR>Knoxville, TN<BR><BR><BR>-----
Original Message -----<BR>From: Ron Cordes<BR>To: Fordnatics ; Classic
Mustangs<BR>Sent: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 6:02 PM<BR>Subject: [CM] Is my carb
to big?<BR><BR><BR>If you guys remember I have just rebuilt my motor maybe a
thousand miles<BR>ago, I am still having the hesitation mostly from a rolling
acceleration,<BR>like maybe toll plazas and the such, I don't want to start
fooling with the<BR>jets or the squirters yet I want to ask is my carb to big?
Some say yes but<BR>some say nah you have vacuum secondary no problem.....well
here we are.<BR><BR>Stock bore 302, flat top pistons (ford factory), 86 302
heads(which reminds<BR>me does any1 have a web site to find the cc of those
heads?), stock rockers,<BR>Eldebrock performer plus cam, ebelbrock performer
RPM intake, Hooker<BR>headers, 2 1/2 inch exhaust with 2 chamber flowmasters,
H-Pipe, 500 over<BR>stock stall (about 1300 RPM) Torque Converter, FMX tranny,
2.73 rear 8"<BR>(soon to be 3.25 9" rear), Petronix ignition, Petronix coil,
BIG cap, JBA<BR>9MM wires, and finally a model 4150 Holley single pump, vacuum
sec. 600 CFM<BR>carb, Model number 1-80145.<BR><BR>If there is any where I can
be steered please let me know, I am just getting<BR>all the questions out of
the way first by the way I have not changed any<BR>jetting, springs, or
accelerator nozzles YET, but I did move the cam on the<BR>carb from 2 to
1.<BR><BR>Ron<BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Classic-mustangs
mailing list<BR><A
href="mailtoemail redacted)">(email redacted)</A><BR><A
href="mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs">mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs</A><BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Classic-mustangs
mailing list<BR><A
href="mailtoemail redacted)">(email redacted)</A><BR><A
href="mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs">mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic-mustangs</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Ron Cordes)

All right here we go I replaced the stock "pink" cam on the carb with the
"red" and hesitation is gone now we need to work on the white plugs I will
check them tomorrow, and the next day to be sure they still need more fuel.

Ron

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) ((email redacted))

Nice going. "White plugs" - I assume that you
mean your plugs look too clean. Be aware that
this is the age of really clean detergent gas.
Even if your mix is right, you will not see color
on your plugs like in the "old days". Unleaded
will not color plugs until you've got A BUNCH of
miles on them. Don't think it's so? I ran 110
octane leaded gas at the Shootout in October.
While racing, the plugs went rather dark,
indicating that I was rich, most likely in the
secondaries. The inside of the collectors were a
nice ash gray, indicated that things were close
to the right mix, even if the plugs said rich.
Just left it that way for the two days. After, I
switched back to 91 super unleaded. I've put
about 400 miles on the car since October. Pulled
the plugs last week - they are nice and white
again.
So, whadddya do? Look for signs of detonation -
flecks of aluminium on the center electrode,
etching or pitting of the metal, a blue
overheated looking side electrode. These can
happen even if you don't hear the rattle. As for
the mix, you'll need an exhaust gas analyzer or
an O2 sensor. Also, you can adjust your main
primary jets by feel. Go down in size until you
get a lean surge during light throttle cruise
(cruise 2000~2500 RPM). Then go up 2 jet sizes.
If I remember, your primary's are 66. These
should be very close to right.

Funny thing about super unleaded - it cleans the
plugs, but it soots up your piston tops and
exhaust pipes like a wood stove.
Chris
> All right here we go I replaced the
stock "pink" cam on the carb with the
> "red" and hesitation is gone now we need to
work on the white plugs I will
> check them tomorrow, and the next day to be
sure they still need more fuel.
>
> Ron
>
> _______________________________________________
> Classic-mustangs mailing list
> (email redacted)
>
mix.twistedpair.ca/mailman/listinfo/classic
-mustangs


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This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Ron Cordes)

Ckelly Wrote:

Unleaded
will not color plugs until you've got A BUNCH of
miles on them.

Then what's up with the old motor, I put new plugs in it (NGK's but that's
another debate) and they colored by the time I drove home..........Same with
my motorcycle, Nice light tan color.....weird.

Ron

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted) (Chris Kelly)

Thinking about it some more, it may have some relation to the ignition. I
have a really high powered multistrike setup. Also, it may just be the
super unleaded - it seems to have the most detergents. Shoot, it may even
be the brand of gas - never thought about that. The real problem is that
for the short term, there may be no reading or tell-tail signs of the mix
on the plugs.
At 11:50 PM 4/24/02 -0400, you wrote:
>Ckelly Wrote:
>
>Unleaded
>will not color plugs until you've got A BUNCH of
>miles on them.
>
>Then what's up with the old motor, I put new plugs in it (NGK's but that's
>another debate) and they colored by the time I drove home..........Same with
>my motorcycle, Nice light tan color.....weird.
>
>Ron
>
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========The Kelly's==============
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Merkel, Texas
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